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Here you can discuss details about instruments, equipment and all those other bits that non-musicians won't understand !

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Russ Gannicott
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Postby Russ Gannicott » Fri Sep 21, 2007 12:47 am

I'd like to propose a new campaign to ban so called 'graphic eq', 'pre amp systems' etc from acoustic guitars. Could someone please tell me what the purpose of these ridiculous, inefectual pieces of budget 'low tech' is? If you need to stuff a fifty quid piece of Chinese electronics into an eight hundred quid Taylor/Martin etc,etc, what does it tell you about the guitar? Sorry about the 'rant' but I'm getting fed up with players who don't know what a guitar is supposed to sound like and blame me for making it sound 'nasty'!
Oooh, kids!
Russ

scottj1
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Postby scottj1 » Mon Sep 24, 2007 12:18 pm

i agree with you russ.for live work i play an ovation which has a certain sound of it's own which i like rather than trying to get a perfect acoustic sound live with fx or adding pickups to my wooden acoustic.i liked the tone gordon used to get when he played ovations which prompted me to buy one.also as i mainly played electric at the time they are very easy to play.

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TimH
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Postby TimH » Tue Sep 25, 2007 3:42 pm

I've been using a Fylde through a Fishman Blend and GG-10 pre-amp for recording solo stuff and also for live work with the band but had pretty much retired the acoustic from live because you just have to spend so much time fiddling to avoid feedback etc. However we did a wedding a couple of weeks ago and me and one of the vocalists wanted to do Eva Cassidy's "Songbird" as a slow dance for bride and groom so I thought I'd bring out the Fylde again for the occasion. However, just as an experiment during sound-check, I went unplugged and just stuck my vocal mic (Sure SM58) up to the sound-hole and dang me if it didn't sound good. No eq, no feedback, no twiddling, just great acoustic tone. Now I guess the purists will denigrate the SM58 for instrument amplification but it sounded good to all ears on the night and I'll be trying that again sometime. Might not work so well with lots of drums and bass rumbling on around behind me (the usual state of affairs!) but for this song it was just me and the girl and it sounded just right. Just goes to show - sometimes the simple approach is best.

Gordon - it was the "prototype" and it sounded delicious!!

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GORDON
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Postby GORDON » Mon Oct 01, 2007 9:37 am

Hi Tim.

Good to see your posting my friend, and of course I'm delighted that the FYLDES continue to give good service, and I bet they ARE sounding good after all the constant use they get. My new cedar top is an awesome beast, and the new 12 string is just amazing.

My best to you and the family.

G.

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GORDON
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Postby GORDON » Mon Oct 01, 2007 9:39 am

Hi Russ.

I bet you feel a whole lot better now that you have got that off yer chest eh!

My best as ever to you and the family.


G.

simjen
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Postby simjen » Tue Oct 02, 2007 1:53 pm

Hi all,

Russ, I couldnt agree more about pre-amps etc. Nuff said.

Tim, interesting comments re mic'ing acoustics. Perenial problem which makes you resort to the dreaded electronics.

For what it's worth, I tried an SM58 the other day (only in my sitting room which is though quite large) and it sounded good. I have a friend who does PA, Video for outside gigs and he lent me a selection of Beyerdynamic mics to try. I found the best in terms of feedback resistance and and sound to be the M88 (which like the SM58 is not meant to be for instrument amplification). Better than the the SM58 but not massively. Expensive option I know but worth it I thought. I may not give it back!

Regards to all,

Simon.
Simon Jenny, long term fan.

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TimH
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Postby TimH » Wed Oct 03, 2007 1:36 pm

That's interesting - thanks. I tried the mic again recently, this time at a pub gig and feedback was immediate and huge so resorted to the Fishman Blend and GG-10 which worked fine although (don't tell Russ) I had to use a Boss EQ pedal to cut the frequencies around 800hz to kill the last remaining feedback. Actually I think Russ was making a point about recording, not live use as such. The only reason I use eq in either environment is to compensate for the effect the surrounding environment has on the natural acoustic tone (and also to compensate for our slightly ropey old PA speakers which don't seem to do 'acoutic guitar' very well!). Gorden gets such a lovely tone from what is really very simple equipment - damn his years of experience and good ear!!!!

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Russ Gannicott
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Well actually......

Postby Russ Gannicott » Thu Oct 04, 2007 6:43 pm

I was taliking about 'live' mainly Tim. I think your set-up sounds great - a decent pick-up and an unequalled pre-amp, it doesn't get much better than that. My belief is that all you need in the guitar is the pick-up, everything else can be done better on eitherthe floor, the amp or the desk.
Interesting points about mics - SM57's are still good....if you want a 'SM57 sound'. Better bet for recording and at about £100 these days is an AKG C1000 small diaphram condenser mic - good for your vocals as well!
Russ

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TimH
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Postby TimH » Thu Oct 04, 2007 7:27 pm

Thanks Russ altough you clearly haven't heard my vocals!! Not even a C1000 could do much to help there!
Cheers,
Tim.

simjen
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Postby simjen » Fri Oct 05, 2007 3:26 pm

Yes, I guess the feedback 'threshold' when using mic's does so depend on the immediate environment. Wise to have an alternative at hand.

Some interesting stuff to mull over here. Gordon does really seem to have the knack of getting excellent sound with relatively simple equipment. As you say, there's no substitute for experience here.

regards to all

Simon.
Simon Jenny, long term fan.


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